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 The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)

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Nmadore
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PostSubject: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:36 pm

This is a series by Dawkins. Dawkins has deep seated critical views of religion in a very similiar way to Neitchze.

I have had many weird experiances with religion and spiritualists. I couldn't believe how silmilar some of Dawkins experiances.
I'm astounded at how blind people can be to rational thought and reason. How can someone just let another person think for them?

Root of All Evil Pt.1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2epvSAGuLc
Root of All Evil Pt.2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEWVch1afbs
Root of All Evil Pt.3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSx0UQBPPo8

Lets discuss these issues. What does everyone else think?
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The Philosopher
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Tue Jan 06, 2009 11:54 pm

It's an interesting Topic Nmadore , I watched the three parts And I think That's what really happen is that many schools inject religions into education systems which is not preferable , I believe that Everyone on earth is free to choose what to believe in regardless what his family believes in !!!. May be that has influence on him somehow But I think Finally he will do what he believe in or what agree with his common sense.

On the other hand , Sometimes Religion or Faith is one of reasons which make people get apart from each other . There is difference between Faith and Religion , Faith is much Important , people in general need a Faith to help them go on in their lives relying on a belief or a hope which give them power to continue !

The knowledge is everywhere for everyone who seek it !!. so Although some people were injected into their brains with certain belief , If they want to know other beliefs , they will seek everywhere around them and oneday they will reach what they were looking for !! Wink

Would like to know what everyone else think ??

_________________
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"He who fights monsters should see to it that in the process, he does not become a monster. And when you look into the abyss, the abyss also looks into you." - Nietzche


Last edited by The Philosopher on Wed May 13, 2009 8:30 am; edited 1 time in total
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Nmadore
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PostSubject: Yeah nice perspective   Wed Jan 07, 2009 3:53 am

I've been through a share with religious fanatics.

Sometimes when you believe so much in something it's hard not to be blind to the realities of everyday life.
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Dewachen
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PostSubject: re: Root of all Evil   Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:13 pm

I also think it is very unfortunate that children are brainwashed into the religion of their family. However, I don’t believe religion is the only problem. The problem seems to me so large and deep rooted in every culture or society that I am not sure one can pinpoint the root of the worlds problems as belonging to one category by definition whether it be religion or monetary in nature. We are all subject to indoctrination and just when one thinks they have the conclusion to the answer new information sheds a new light. There is always something new to learn and seems to be a contradiction to definitive answers in general. I have felt the effects of religious indoctrination from the beginning but have always rebelled against this attempt to brainwash me unlike anyone else in my family (when I say family I mean my entire family on my mothers side being related to Brigham Young and all.) The reason I rebelled was what I felt to be my own personal identity I was born with conflicted with what my family tried to ram down my throat. It was demanded of me to give up my own personal experiences for a very bad B rated version of reality I knew was false. However, to be fair it was not just my family that was the problem. The problem is global and multifaceted on many different levels which seems to be very deeply rooted and has infected all levels of society. If our youth are not encouraged to think in a logical structure then how can diversity have any positive bearing on the beauties and fantastic mysteries that are all around us? It is like a tangled up rope that keeps becoming more taut and tangled up as we gleefully march towards the proverbial precipice in the name of religion, patriotism, and all the devices which can be abused by those who would like to use these things to keep the human spirit subservient to its benefactors. I remember one of my first encounters of the dysfunction of society at the age of 13 months when I witnessed the JFK assassination on the television and my fathers reply to shut that ******* kid up. He didn’t know why I was so upset nor the depth from which the tears flowed. It is no wonder the world is in such disarray with the kind of insanity that has infected our society. There are those being born into our world that can and will be of benefit to humanity but real change will be a very long going process if we survive as a species. I will include a poem I wrote to this thread I wrote several months ago. I hope you all enjoy.



[THE SECRET PORTAL FROM SAMSARA



Country lost, journey south, the crown fell from twenty-nine.
Thousands prayed from the solar reflection upon the jewel of blue in the deep,
black of misty night.
Wind horse prayers,
skyward bound upon plumes of smoke from the burning vault of oblivions abolition,
sending the dead king beyond the blue orb of heaven's design.
The great mother of all beckons from her secret doorway,
desire beyond desires,
burning a hundred-trillion solar candles from her mighty arms' embrace,
of unity unknown.
From her single, laser point reflections,
blazing in my heart and mind, the debt to which I feel, in awe of her presence divine.

"I pledge my life in service to that from which I sprung."

She beckons
"Give up that which you think you know, and enter unto me, whose essence is union and oblation to all,
For through me is the birth within infinite light.
All who enter the horizon of my black, sempiternal embrace will never be the same, and a new crown acquired.
As you know not yet the crown which waits,
So shall you be unknown upon return to the sea from which you sprung.
And gold, forged in steel,
precious jewels of water,
an oasis for the weary traveler on the long road,
to where all points converge from autumn, winter, and spring.
For the goal sought in the misty abode of mind's reflection
Will become an actuality,
but beyond what you currently know,
and not by way of surfeit.
Then upon return, the gold remains hidden,
tempered within steel of tales untold of the summit of Muru,
of that which lies beyond the portal.
For there is a veil of division in unity formed,
Etched and interwoven strings from points' reflection,
Upon the canvas of realities,
designed in the sea of ignorance,
Stands the crowned and conquering monkey,
rooted in desire of the key,
elusive and void of oblation to the root."

Within the blue egg of my earthly mother's womb,
Dreaming of a dark terrain, lit by solar twilight of the setting, crimson sun,
A warning of things to come.
Gazing in remembrance of tales of the sun,
I looked into the eyes of those I met and asked, "Do you remember? Do you know who I am?"
To my horror and disbelief, betrayal from within.
A shot rang out from the black car of death, ripping out blood, bone, and brain.
Another crown had fallen, and stained the crimson sun, setting to a new dawn of that unknown.
What is the meaning of this riddle? Unknown?
For we have just begun.
Or, have we just begun?
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Harrifer
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Sun Aug 09, 2009 5:52 am

Religion in itself is nothing. It does not exist without humans. We may say God exists without us, and others may disagree, but to say religion exists without us is obviously not true.

An idea, a set of values, practises, beleifs, never strangled anyone in the night. It never hung anyone from a tree, and it never lined people up and shot them. People did that, and it's a harrowing thought, because it asks the question, 'Could I do that too?'

Few people want to consider the answer to that question.

In my mind, real religion means to love God, and/or to realise one's spiritual nature. I see those themes as the essence of religion.

As far as I'm aware, the desire to enjoy the material world selfishly, with no thought for the consequnces is the root of all evil. Evil is desire for enjoyment. Evil says 'I come first, and I don't care who I have to tread on'. Evil is selfishness.

So how is the Islamic Jihadi selfish? He wants 72 virgins in paradise, and he will kill hundreds to get that. That sounds pretty selfish to me.

The desire to make the people who would not submit to your philosophy do so by the threat of violence is selfish. People don't conquer in God's name, they conquer in their own name, to prove themselves right. 'I am right because I have won'

Where in the idea of God is there incitement to aggression?
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Dewachen
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Sun Aug 09, 2009 10:38 am

To say religion its self is nothing and has no influence on people is to say that ones beliefs have no value to the person that believes which also contradicts your statement the only real religion is to love God. This brings you back to the question what is god? Most people have no conception of god other than what is taught in religion. This is not a game of win or lose I am right and you are wrong it is the active will to look at things from a different perspective because there is always something new to learn or none of us would be here. Some of your logic is good but much of it is a contradiction which is going round and round. I say this not to point fingers but to help you revaluate your critical thinking which will truly help you realize your spiritual nature as you say without simply following your love of god in a blind sense.Also, to say that religion is responsible for nothing is to say that the body is responsible for the acts and not the brain or that the weapon is responsible and not the person pulling the trigger.
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Sun Aug 09, 2009 5:58 pm

Dewachen wrote:
To say religion its self is nothing and has no influence on people

I didn't say that. I said it was the people who act not the religions. An idea never hurt anyone, only the people who held that idea. Please reread my post.

Dewachen wrote:
is to say that ones beliefs have no value to the person that believes which also contradicts your statement the only real religion is to love God. This brings you back to the question what is god? Most people have no conception of god other than what is taught in religion.

Now you're rebutting something I didn't say, but you raise good questions. AS i said, in my opinion real religion means to love God. 'faith through grace, not works', condeming others for having different beleifs, this isn't love of God, it's nonsense. If your understanding of God is the same as your understanding of Julius Caesar, as some hisstorical figure who did this or that, or if your understanding of God is that God is only that God is some person who wants you to do this and that then how can you say there is love of God? I can understand that those aspects can be there, but they aren't the vital ingredient.

What is god? The clue's in the title really. It doesn't matter how a person sees God, as far as I am concerned.

So this will lead to a question, 'what about the times when some religions are told to kill others for not converting etc'. Well plain and simple that's made up. Who is this loving God who commands genocide? That sounds very earthly to me.

Dewachen wrote:
This is not a game of win or lose I am right and you are wrong it is the active will to look at things from a different perspective because there is always something new to learn or none of us would be here. Some of your logic is good but much of it is a contradiction which is going round and round. I say this not to point fingers but to help you revaluate your critical thinking which will truly help you realize your spiritual nature as you say without simply following your love of god in a blind sense.

Thank you Professor, and shall we resume class after recess?

Dewachen wrote:
Also, to say that religion is responsible for nothing is to say that the body is responsible for the acts and not the brain or that the weapon is responsible and not the person pulling the trigger.

No it is the opposite of that. I said the ideas do nothing, it is the people holding them. Please re-read my post before you make the same points I already have.

I apologise if I didn't fully explain myself in my origional post, perhaps you understand my point better now.
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:25 am

Okay, I reversed it and you are right and won the argument. I am glad you know god so well and are so much further along the path. I guess I have been deluding myself for 47 years. I just can’t believe it took me this long to learn such a simple thing from a 19 year old. I think I should not post anymore to this forum and stick to my janitorial duties, because I don’t know what I am talking about. Thanks
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PostSubject: Re: The Root of All Evil...(Richard Dawkins)   Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:35 am

Dewachen wrote:
Okay, I reversed it and you are right and won the argument. I am glad you know god so well and are so much further along the path. I guess I have been deluding myself for 47 years. I just can’t believe it took me this long to learn such a simple thing from a 19 year old. I think I should not post anymore to this forum and stick to my janitorial duties, because I don’t know what I am talking about. Thanks

We weren't having an argument, you misunderstood my post.

There's no need to be like that, I'm sorry if I mocked your tone, I meant it light heartedly, feel free to do the same.

I agree with you, that it is the people, and not the ideas/tools that are responsible for actions. I apologise if my initial post was badly written, but that was my main point.

I agree with you that it's not about winning an argument. Was my tone too hostile? I'm sorry if it was.

I hope it doesn't seem strange that I responded so quickly, I get notified by email when people respond to my posts.
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